diff --git a/gtk2_ardour/editor_drag.cc b/gtk2_ardour/editor_drag.cc
index 2775e4ee40..e63d9ccf5b 100644
--- a/gtk2_ardour/editor_drag.cc
+++ b/gtk2_ardour/editor_drag.cc
@@ -6852,11 +6852,11 @@ NoteCreateDrag::start_grab (GdkEvent* event, Gdk::Cursor* cursor)
 
 	const timepos_t       pos = _drags->current_pointer_time ();
 	Temporal::Beats       aligned_beats (round_to_grid (pos, event));
-	const Temporal::Beats grid_beats (_midi_view->get_draw_length_beats (pos));
+	const Temporal::Beats min_length (0, Temporal::Beats::PPQN/ 128);
 
 	_note[0] = timepos_t (aligned_beats);
 	/* minimum initial length is grid beats */
-	_note[1] = _note[0] + timepos_t (grid_beats);
+	_note[1] = _note[0] + timepos_t (min_length);
 
 	/* the note positions we've just computed are in absolute beats, but
 	 * the drag rect is a member of the region view group, so we need
@@ -6882,7 +6882,7 @@ NoteCreateDrag::motion (GdkEvent* event, bool)
 	const timepos_t pos = _drags->current_pointer_time ();
 
 	/* when the user clicks and starts a drag to define the note's length, require notes to be at least |this| long */
-	const Temporal::Beats min_length (_midi_view->get_draw_length_beats (pos));
+	const Temporal::Beats min_length (0, Temporal::Beats::PPQN / 128);
 	Temporal::Beats       aligned_beats = round_to_grid (pos, event);
 
 	_note[1] = std::max (aligned_beats, (_note[0].beats () + min_length));
@@ -6899,12 +6899,18 @@ NoteCreateDrag::motion (GdkEvent* event, bool)
 void
 NoteCreateDrag::finished (GdkEvent* ev, bool had_movement)
 {
-	/* we create a note even if there was no movement */
+	Beats length;
 
 	/* Compute start within region, rather than absolute time start */
 
 	Beats const start  = _midi_view->midi_region ()->absolute_time_to_region_beats (min (_note[0], _note[1]));
-	Beats       length = max (Beats (0, 1), (_note[0].distance (_note[1]).abs ().beats ()));
+
+	if (!had_movement) {
+		/* we create a note even if there was no movement */
+		length = _midi_view->get_draw_length_beats (_note[0]);
+	} else {
+		length = _note[0].distance (_note[1]).abs ().beats ();
+	}
 
 	/* create_note_at() implements UNDO for us */
 	if (UIConfiguration::instance().get_select_last_drawn_note_only()) {
diff --git a/gtk2_ardour/midi_cue_view.cc b/gtk2_ardour/midi_cue_view.cc
index e2bc66a2b1..89011d35fa 100644
--- a/gtk2_ardour/midi_cue_view.cc
+++ b/gtk2_ardour/midi_cue_view.cc
@@ -53,6 +53,8 @@ MidiCueView::MidiCueView (std::shared_ptr<ARDOUR::MidiTrack> mt,
 	event_rect->set_outline (false);
 
 	_note_group->raise_to_top ();
+
+	set_extensible (true);
 }
 
 void
diff --git a/gtk2_ardour/midi_cue_view.h b/gtk2_ardour/midi_cue_view.h
index c27d39b791..c1e49a7135 100644
--- a/gtk2_ardour/midi_cue_view.h
+++ b/gtk2_ardour/midi_cue_view.h
@@ -41,6 +41,10 @@ class MidiCueView : public MidiView
 	void set_height (double);
 
 	ArdourCanvas::Item* drag_group() const;
+	bool note_in_region_range (const std::shared_ptr<NoteType> note, bool& visible) const {
+		visible = true;
+		return true;
+	}
 
   protected:
 	bool scroll (GdkEventScroll* ev);
diff --git a/gtk2_ardour/midi_view.cc b/gtk2_ardour/midi_view.cc
index 0312a3a35a..1438a44313 100644
--- a/gtk2_ardour/midi_view.cc
+++ b/gtk2_ardour/midi_view.cc
@@ -135,6 +135,7 @@ MidiView::MidiView (std::shared_ptr<MidiTrack> mt,
 	, _mouse_changed_selection (false)
 	, split_tuple (0)
 	, note_splitting (false)
+	, _extensible (false)
 {
 	init ();
 }
@@ -1095,7 +1096,7 @@ MidiView::model_changed()
 		std::shared_ptr<NoteType> note (*n);
 		bool visible;
 
-		if (note_in_region_range (note, visible)) {
+		if (_extensible || note_in_region_range (note, visible)) {
 			if (!empty_when_starting && (cne = find_canvas_note (note)) != 0) {
 				cne->validate ();
 				if (visible) {
@@ -1648,7 +1649,7 @@ MidiView::update_sustained (Note* ev, bool update_ghost_regions)
 
 		const Temporal::Beats source_end ((_midi_region->start() + _midi_region->length()).beats());
 
-		if (note->end_time() > source_end) {
+		if (!_extensible && note->end_time() > source_end) {
 			note_end = timepos_t (source_end);
 		}
 
diff --git a/gtk2_ardour/midi_view.h b/gtk2_ardour/midi_view.h
index 763467825a..dcbc22d0cd 100644
--- a/gtk2_ardour/midi_view.h
+++ b/gtk2_ardour/midi_view.h
@@ -229,7 +229,7 @@ class MidiView : public virtual sigc::trackable
 	 * @param visible will be set to true if the note is within the visible note range, false otherwise.
 	 * @return true iff the note is within the (time) extent of the region.
 	 */
-	bool note_in_region_range(const std::shared_ptr<NoteType> note, bool& visible) const;
+	virtual bool note_in_region_range(const std::shared_ptr<NoteType> note, bool& visible) const;
 	/* Test if a note is withing this region's time range. Return true if so */
 	bool note_in_region_time_range(const std::shared_ptr<NoteType> note) const;
 
@@ -625,6 +625,10 @@ class MidiView : public virtual sigc::trackable
 
 	uint32_t split_tuple;
 	bool     note_splitting;
+	bool    _extensible; /* if true, we can add data beyond the current region/source end */
+
+	bool extensible() const { return _extensible; }
+	void set_extensible (bool yn) { _extensible = yn; }
 
 	void start_note_splitting ();
 	void end_note_splitting ();